Ladies Kickin' Ass

#131 - Empowered Women, Stronger Trades - with Hacia Atherton

• Tanya Wilson • Episode 131

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In this inspiring episode of the Ladies Kickin' Ass Podcast, Tanya Wilson interviews Hacia Atherton, the incredible founder of Empowered Women in Trades (EWIT). Hacia shares her personal journey of overcoming a life-altering accident to become a leader in the construction industry. The conversation dives deep into women's unique challenges in the trades, from navigating cultural barriers to battling self-doubt. Hacia talks about the significance of community, mentorship, and psychological support and offers insight into how we can inspire the next generation of women to pursue careers in trades. This powerful episode showcases the need for cultural change, respect, and equality in male-dominated industries and highlights women's value in the trades.

Key Takeaways:

  • Hacia’s story of resilience and determination after a life-threatening accident is a testament to the power of self-belief.
  • Women in trades face unique challenges, such as harassment, physical endurance concerns, and self-doubt.
  • Empowered Women in Trades is building a supportive community to uplift women in these industries.
  • Cultural change is essential for creating a more inclusive and respectful trade environment.
  • Women bring unique skills and perspectives to the trades, often excelling in specialized sectors.
  • Education and outreach can inspire young women to pursue trade careers.
  • Psychological safety and proper workplace amenities are crucial for women’s success in trades.
  • Women should never underestimate their value or potential in any industry.

Episode Highlights:
Can overcoming a life-threatening accident redefine the limits of what's possible? Meet Hacia Atherton from Australia, a trailblazer in the construction industry and the founder of Empowered Women in Trades. Hacia shares her journey from being told she might never walk again to running a half marathon. Her story isn’t just about physical recovery—it's about mental strength, resilience, and a drive to break barriers for women in the trades.

We also discuss the challenges women face in trades and practical solutions, such as ensuring proper facilities and psychological safety. Hacia emphasizes how women bring immense value to the trades and are often preferred in specialized industries like hospitals, schools, and women’s shelters. This episode covers everything from empowering women through education and mentorship to Hacia’s plans for expanding her global movement.

Tune in to hear how you can support gender equality in the trades industry and be part of a movement to foster community, respect, and opportunity for all. If you’re ready to be inspired and empowered, this episode is for you.

Connect with Hacia
LinkedIn   Instagram    Hacia's Website    Empowered Women In Trades (EWIT)

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Speaker 1:

Welcome to the Ladies Kickin' Ass Podcast, where we help you ignite your inner badass and create the service business of your dreams. I'm your host, Tanya Wilson, and together we'll dive into inspiring stories and expert coaching to set your journey on fire hey, badasses, welcome back to the podcast.

Speaker 2:

Today is going to be a good one, oh my gosh. I'm so excited to be able to bring this next guest to the ladies kickin ass community because I am just kind of fangirling over here because I'm so inspired by her story and what she's been able to do for women in the trades. So today we have Haseya Atherton with us. She is from Australia, which is a new thing for the podcast guests here on Ladies Kickin' Ass, and she is recognized in the construction industry as a leader, as a thought leader, as someone that is trying to make big changes for women in the trades.

Speaker 2:

I love that you use the term a tradie, because that's what they need to say, something fun like that here in this state. But she is the founder of Empowered Women in the Trades, and what an incredible organization it is. We're going to talk all about that today. But Hazy also has one hell of a backstory and you're going to be so inspired about what she has risen up from and what she's been able to do with her life. So thank you so much for being on the podcast today. Why don't you go ahead and give us a little bit of that backstory and tell us this journey that you've been on for the last several years.

Speaker 3:

Yes, thank you so much for being here. I'm really excited and the backstory towards setting up the business all links in together. So I'm actually from a fifth generation plumbing family. So my great great grandfather came over from England to Australia and he was one of the founding contractors of an association that we have here called the Master Plumbers Association. But despite all the family history, I went off and followed, like my academic careers, becoming an accountant, and my focus was very much on writing. So I wanted to represent my country in equestrian in dressage, and I was getting close to that goal.

Speaker 3:

But on one very cold winter's evening I was training my young horse and she decided to rear her and I fell off and all 600 kilos of her came over and landed on top of me. Came over and landed on top of me. So that doesn't work very well. You know, 70 kilo human, 600 kilo horse equals human being literally. So I got airlifted to one of the major hospitals in Melbourne, australia, and was told that I was most likely never going to walk again, that there was only millimeters in whether I was even going to be able to have that conversation. So she landed on me slightly different. We wouldn't be having this conversation this morning.

Speaker 3:

For me, it's 5.30am over here in Australia and so I had to spend six months in hospital earlier. And so I had to spend six months in hospital learning how to stand again, really pushing through so much self-doubt, so much kind of identity. I identified as a dressage rider. That was my whole life. And then for the first three months in hospital I literally lay lifeless in a hospital bed. I couldn't move. If I dropped something on the ground I couldn't pick it up. I was completely, 100% dependent on other people and, being a very independent woman, that was a lot to go through and really a lot to understand how to become vulnerable and really let other people support me and help me.

Speaker 3:

So after three months I was cleared for weight bearing. So I stood up on land 117 days after accident and I reckon that's probably the hardest thing I've ever done. And even when I'm on construction sites and men tell me women aren't tough enough to be tradies, I literally like show them my x-rays, because I've had 30 surgeries, I've got computers inside me, I've got a bunch of metal, my hips being replaced, like, as you can imagine, being crushed by a horse. There's a lot of work that has to be done to put Humpty Dumpty back together again. Um, so I use my story a lot when men really doubt that women have the physical strength, mental strength, to be in the trades. And after a time I started to teach myself to walk again against all of the odds, and I've even run a half marathon since. So it really goes to show if someone, even professionals, are telling you you can't do something, if you know inside yourself you can do it, then you can turn the impossible into possible.

Speaker 2:

Oh my gosh, that is so incredible. Well, just already, that story in itself just shows the incredible resilience and brilliance of anyone that wants to actually do something. You know, it's just so many people get told you can't do that and they have so much self-doubt that they just really don't ever start living a life that they want to have. It's just like whatever cards were dealt to me is what I have. So thank you for being a glowing example that that's bullshit in like every way, shape and form 100%, like it's just no excuse mindset.

Speaker 3:

If you want something, if you truly believe that what that's what you want to have in your life. Like when I was learning to walk again, I would be in my hospital and every day we'd have to put up three goals and it would be like transfer from the bed to the wheelchair, um, like learn how to use the wheelchair around corners or up hills, like very, um, very basic stuff. And then number three was always learn to walk again. So I always had that goal. Just Just before the accident happened, I actually came back to work at my family company that now like manufactures medical infection control equipment and my dad said you've got all of your business acumen and you've worked at other companies and everything. I want you to go experience the trade side of the business and go work on the factory floor. And it was a really interesting experience because I've grown up around this factory like I walked around the factory as like a little baby and a little toddler. I was brought into the company when I was in a bassinet, like a few weeks old. So I've been around these people, I've been in the company for my whole entire life. But something weird happened when I put the steel cap boots on, the high V's on and I walked in there, I all of a sudden just shrunk. I was telling myself I didn't belong there. The boys are going to think I'm some kind of joke. They're going to laugh at me. All of this negative self-talk started happening and within my family company everyone was really supportive to a fact. One of the tradesmen actually called me out when I was like see, I'm a girl, I can't weld, and he's like the welder has no idea if you're a girl or a guy like you're the one that's told you that. Yeah, that's awesome, that was really amazing. But what would happen when I was out and about in public? I would get harassed. So men would say it's not Halloween, why are you dressed up as a tradie? Or was it laundry day? Because you're wearing your boyfriend's clothes or just all of these different things. So there was a lot of men outside my family company that would say very unkind things to me. There's a lot worse things that have been said to me now that I've got my business.

Speaker 3:

But so when the accident happened I was working on the factory floor and I obviously had that six months in hospital, so a lot of time, a lot of time on my hands, so I started to reach out on Instagram to like other women in the industry to see if that was just like a me thing or what they were experiencing. And so many of the women are like, yeah, I'm thinking about leaving. The culture's terrible. All I do is want to do my job and all I do is get harassed or hit on or gawked at or, even worse, like here in Australia, there's stories of women in the trades industry that men have like urinated all over so they're like pissed on them on site and it's like holy, yeah. So I was getting all these stories and then I was like, hmm, I'm going to reach out to some women not in the industry and be like would you ever think about doing becoming a tradie? And so I met the women who were like I wouldn't even know where to start. I have no idea what a fitter and turner is, or a gas fitter or anything like that. And so I thought, wow, there's this massive, massive problem where women who aren't in the industry don't understand the industry or understand how to get into the industry the women in the industry because the culture is so terrible it was wanting to leave the industry. At the time, female representation in the trades in Australia was just 2%, so tiny. We're only 3% now, but that's progress at least.

Speaker 3:

So when I was in hospital I just thought, wow, there is so much work that needs to be done.

Speaker 3:

This is not going to just be done by like individual companies. We need to set up a movement, a movement and a community. Support these women that are really isolated the industry. Bring them together so that they can network, they can meet each other, they can create friendships, but also design products and services for industry to help with the culture. Support the men in the industry to transform their leadership styles, their their communication styles, their mindsets, the way that they perceive and value women, and then also support women to understand how to get into these jobs and how to get into these roles. And we do a lot of work in the schools as well, because it's really important getting in front of those young female students these career opportunities, especially if they're disengaged from the academic career pathway of going to college and university and different things like that. For a lot of those women they don't have hope that they're going to have successful lives, but the trades is going to give that to them, so that's why I get so excited about it.

Speaker 2:

The potential in the trades for women is mind blowing, you know, if you really think about, like, the time period of time that we live in right now, like I know in the States, like they talk about how 10,000 baby boomers a day so people that you know are starting to hit that retirement age are retiring 10,000 a day. This is the greatest population like generation of the United States ever they're retiring. Of those, about 12% of them own businesses and a lot of them are trades businesses that their kids don't want to run, their family's not interested in taking over. But they also have these smaller trades businesses that aren't really like the level where, like, big companies want to come in and buy them and so a lot of them are just really dying off because they have no one to come in and run them.

Speaker 2:

These gentlemen and ladies that have are retiring. They are the business you know. They didn't grow like this big master plan to work themselves out of their job there. They still have a job at the business. They need somebody that wants to come in and take over the business, that wants to work in it. But people just are not interested and it's so crazy that there's like 20, 30, 40 years of experience and they're just having to shut these businesses down. There's so much opportunity for women to come in, especially with a business like that, where you add a little love to it.

Speaker 2:

You come in and you know, restore a beautiful culture or create a culture of family and love and growth and great mindset, pay them what they're worth. Throw some modern marketing in there and you've got like a done for you business in a box already. So it's really cool what you are putting together here. What are some of the things that when you're talking to women that are getting into the trades, that are learning how to do it, what are some of their biggest fears getting into the trades and what are their some? What are some of their biggest inspirations for wanting to be in the trades?

Speaker 3:

yeah, most of their fears are again around safety, and that's a question we as women ask ourselves on the hour, every hour. We're always analyzing and asking that question are are we going to be safe? Now, unfortunately, in the trades industry, there is a lot of sad stories around sexual harassment, bullying, unsafe practices for all humans too, and it's not just towards the feminine genders that those kind of concepts of bullying and harassment more so the sexual harassment, but bullying, harassment, unsafe work sites have been there for the male demographic as well. So a lot of women are very much like am I going to be physically safe? Am I going to be mentally safe? Is this a place that I'm going to be able to go to and feel safe in? So that's a big question, and that's why we have our EWIT Alliance, which brings together all of the employers that are very focused on safety for all human beings, whether that's physical safety or psychological safety, making sure women have the right PPE gear, that they're wearing clothes that actually fit them, not just like this is our company logo clothes, extra small men's, you make it fit your love, not that kind of attitude as well. So that's a big thing around women. Is the safety Then the next thing I see is really that self-doubt like am I going to be good enough?

Speaker 3:

Can I keep up with the boys? Am I strong enough? Uh, will I be able to have the endurance to go six days a week, 10 hour days? Um, can I work outside in the middle of winter? Like all of these kind of self-doubt questions that they often ask themselves. And again, because it is one of the world's most male dominated jobs, a lot of women are like well, do I even belong there? Again questions around is there toilets? Is there change rooms? Is there sanitary bins? Is there sanitary items on site? If the site's like two hours away from any kind of shops, what happens if I get my period in the middle of this site? And all of those. So there's a lot of practical questions. There's a lot of questions around safety and there's a lot of questions around the doubt of whether we're actually physically and mentally capable of doing as well.

Speaker 3:

What I find so exciting and inspiring, once women can move through those barriers, is again what you're talking about, like so many of them can see the opportunities to set up businesses or work for businesses and take over businesses, that they can actually help those businesses grow their market share and tap into new markets that if they didn't have a female tradie they would struggle to tap into, and that's everything from women's shelters for women that's experienced domestic violence and a lot of tradeswomen find that really rewarding. Knowing that they can go to a home with a woman that has experienced domestic violence and fix her toilet or install a new security system or do things like that is really rewarding for a lot of women in the trades. And then there's a lot of hospitals that prefer to have tradeswomen come into the maternity wards and the ICU wards. Schools a lot of schools like to have female tradespeople, so it's really exciting for women to go wow, actually I can come into these businesses and help them grow their businesses, help them move into markets. Even just financially empowered independent women prefer to have a female in their home than be alone in their home with a male tradesperson. So there's a huge, huge business case to bring women into the industry. And women can see that, the value that they're adding and what I really love.

Speaker 3:

And women, we're creators. We bring life into this world. That's what we do, and you can see the connection between that kind of drive that we have that biological drive and creating something in the trade. Every tradeswoman I speak to is like I love bringing my friends or my kids or my family and go. I was part of building that building. I've added to society, I've created something in society. That's going to be that legacy. It's going to be a legacy that lasts longer than me that home or that building that I created, or the car that I was a part of manufacturing, or like if they're in service-based trades, knowing that they're creating safe environments for other humans to live in.

Speaker 3:

Um connection between who we are as women and our feminine desire to to protect, to build, to create, being executed through the trade space. And then the final thing is the really philanthropic side of trades. In australia, so many women get into the trades and they're very excited to go to, like cambodia and build a house for a cambodian family or go to some third world countries and be involved in getting clean water to a village. And there's this whole philanthropic side of the trades that I really see resonate and inspire and excite women to get into the industry yeah, it's just an industry where I think service-based love really can shine and I think that every woman possesses that.

Speaker 2:

Just they're really great at empathy. So when people call, I know this is something in our office. I run a septic and commercial wastewater business so when people call, they're like I got shit coming up in my bathtub. You know like they got some serious issues going on, you know. But to be empathetic with them and it's like I'm so sorry that you're having such a rough day, you know we're gonna get that taken care of and be able to like calm them down. I'm like it's almost like therapy on the phone, because a lot of our stuff is emergency-based calls that we get. That you really have to have that special touch and I've had guys on the phone and I've had ladies on the phone and the ladies tend to get better reviews than a lot of my guys do on the phone of like you were so calm, you were so sweet, you walked me through everything, like that was just really cool. But to even have women show up at the job site so many times, it's such a pleasant surprise.

Speaker 2:

I had a junk removal company that my friend and I ran together as well, and when we would book the calls and she would show up, they'd be like uh, just you, just me. They're like uh, and like so many times people in the home would be like help you try to help her, do so. She's like no, you paid us to come out here. You know she would have a helper, but lots of times it was female based. We had a lot of females that worked there and it was such a cool surprise to see that they were not expecting that. So I love the you know, really non-expectation of women being in this industry too, I think is really really cool. What do you get as far as feedback from when you're working in the schools? This is something I'm super interested in talking more about. What is the feedback that you get from those young females when you go in and talk to the schools? Are they kind of like yeah, okay, or do they see potential and they do see some? You do see some excitement behind them.

Speaker 3:

I see such great excitement. There's a beautiful example of this one student that we work with. She was very disengaged. She came, actually came into the session and she saw the hammers and she's like, yay, who are you going to hit today with the hammers? Like she just was a very uh lost, I think, in the traditional school system by the end the day and she'd been making like planter boxes so she'd been learning some carpentry tools. She actually came to my team and she's like I see there's a little bit of extra material left over. Would I be able to like buy it or take it home because I actually want to make these planter boxes and sell them? And so we gave her the extra stuff. Some of our corporate partners actually sponsored some materials and everything for her and now she makes these planted boxes and she sells them at the local market and she's learning again around budgeting costing how much is the materials? What does she have to sell it for? So all of a sudden she's gone from completely disengaged, her parents really concerned about her, the school concerned about to. She's running her little side hustle through her carpentry skills that she taught. So I think that's a beautiful example of how it can really turn students' lives around that didn't understand this career pathway.

Speaker 3:

The other thing I love about even the female students that engage in the programs and go okay, I see the value, but it wasn't for me. You see them starting to talk to their friends and they'd be like well, have you actually thought about doing trades? I did this trade day. I don't want to be it, but it actually seems like a really cool career pathway and if you don't want to go off and do college and do the academic career pathways, you should check it out.

Speaker 3:

So it's really great to see that change in mindset where before they have that experience in schools, they're probably. If someone one of their friends said I'm thinking about being a tradie, they'd be like oh, what for? Like? Why would you do that? Like? Yeah, it's really important to expose all females to it so that they can decide if it's for them or not for them. But if it's not for them, so that they can understand the value, they can understand the attraction, they can understand the importance of that career pathway and they can understand that it is a very successful career pathway with a long-term jeopardy to the career, a lifetime career in the industry yes, and to respect it.

Speaker 2:

I think that's one of the things for me is, when people learn, like my industry, they're like, wow, I had no idea that was so involved. You know, people flush the toilet and they think it disappears because no one ever has to deal with it afterwards, you know. So it's really cool to educate people. And they're like wow, I had no idea. Like I had no idea that soil played such a big deal in, like a septic system being installed somewhere. And the more you can educate people, the more they gain respect for the trade itself. And the more you can educate people, the more they gain respect for the trade itself. It's not just a bunch of losers that didn't go to college and they didn't have a great, you know life. So this is where they got stuck.

Speaker 2:

Like it's a choice that, a really conscious choice that males and females are now making to be part of the trades. One, the demand is sky high. I'm sure it probably is in Australia, like it is in the States. Like it's absolutely like we can't hire enough people qualified, good people that will consistently show up and do a good job and care. So if you're somebody like that I mean even if you get the experience working with someone and you start your own business. You've now got time, flexibility, ability to make your own whatever you want've now got time, flexibility, ability to make your own whatever you want kind of paychecks, which a lot of them will afford that anyways but you can create a hell of a business in the trades and it wasn't this second rate choice because you didn't go to college.

Speaker 2:

It was a conscious choice you made to not be in student loan debt for the rest of your life and to have a career path that you're very, very proud of. You know, not everybody is meant to have butts in seats and pay attention to something. My son struggles with that terribly, but you give him something he's interested in, he can do with his hands, he will be entertained for hours and we just need to understand that there's not just one path to success. Like I love what you do because you're showing that the trades is success, it's not a secondary choice, so I love that. I would also love to hear you speak more on, since we were talking about respect what respect equality looks like and what you're trying to do with that through the organization and bring it to light in the trades.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. So my concept and egos in that is let's just come down to our human level how do we unite, how do we connect and how do we understand each other from a human lens? So, if you look at the psychology of all humans, regardless of where we're born or what bodies biological bodies we're born into, we all, as humans, need to feel a sense of belonging, a sense of confidence and a sense of autonomy. So respect, equality is very much around. Coming down to that basic, real foundation of ourselves as human beings and understanding how do we build up from there to ensure that all have access to opportunities, resources and rights without discrimination connected to their gender, and understanding that, as we build up, different genders do need different forms of support.

Speaker 3:

Female bodies go through something that male bodies do not go through we menstruate. So we do need certain support, whether that is if a female is menstruating and on that day she does have dizziness and nausea. Don't put her up on the ladder and create a culture where it's psychologically safe enough for her to say hey, today's not a great day, I can't go on the ladder today and find other jobs like the trade-based industry. There's other jobs. If she can't go up on the ladder, fine again, like if she needs to have heat packs and and help carrying her tool belt on one or two days a month because she's got a lot of pain through her menstruation. Provide that support to her and that's respect, equality. That's not going. Oh, we have to be exactly the same. No, we need to build environments, both psychological and physical, that support both biological bodies in the world.

Speaker 2:

Yes, that is so important because you see the traits kind of being like Kate, if you're going to work in here, you have to be just like the guys, because we're making zero concessions for you because you're a woman, you just have to come in and we're not going to change anything because we're mostly guys here. So I love that that's a conversation that you put on the table, because a lot of people don't even think about that, especially if it's male ownership or male leadership and it's like it's not to be like you should know better. They just don't know better. You know, I really think there's a lot of times they're trying to do the best that they can know better. You know, I really think they're a lot of times they're trying to do the best that they can, but they get feedback too, from the other male workers, I'm sure. So it's a delicate balance to get through. So I love so much it is and how I handle the conversation.

Speaker 3:

I'm like, okay, well, what amenities do you have? Do you have like instant coffee? Do you have like we call it Milo over here in Australia, which is like to make hot chocolate, so putting like chocolate chocolate into milk? Like, what amenities do you have? And the guys will talk through what they have in their in their kitchen for their staff, whether that's tea bags or something like that and like so why did you decide to get that? Oh, the guys like that brand of tea and like well, again, again, the. What the women are asking for, like sanitary bins or sanitary items in a first aid kit so that they don't get caught off. That's just like getting tea bags for the guys that you like. You know, for the tea bags. Coffee, hot chocolate in the lunchroom, because human beings desire a hot drink. Female human beings desire sanitary items. Like, if you're going to go and buy coffee, go and buy some sanitary items.

Speaker 2:

It's not that difficult.

Speaker 3:

No exactly Because, if you say, well, you buy coffee and not all of your team drinks coffee, not every single person you employ is going to drink coffee, so why can't you go buy sanitary items just because not single person you employ is going to drink coffee? So why can't you go buy sanitary items just because not every person you employ is going to need the sanitary items, like you are buying stuff that not every human that you employ uses. So I really love working with the men to put it down to that position. Like some people drink coffee, some people need sanitary bins, some people drink tea, it's the same. It's just what our bodies desire and need to do.

Speaker 3:

Unfortunately, women can't choose whether we need sanitary items or not, versus we can choose if we drink coffee or not. So there's a little bit more of a desire and need to make sure that the males are providing that support. But again, it's very simple. We're talking about buying a bin, guys. We're not talking about, like rebuilding a whole building for us. We just need a bin, a lock on the door and some sanitary items in the first aid kit seems pretty simple to me.

Speaker 2:

I don't know why it's such a big deal Change scares me in this industry though Any kind of change that they may experience. It's like I don't know positions like this. How does your organization work with employers in the trades to integrate and be more open to females joining in those trades positions?

Speaker 3:

For the work we do. We actually start with the male leaders and do a lot of work with them to first of all make sure they're not anchoring their masculine identity to their trade, because if they feel like they're a man because they're a plumber or they're a carpenter or they're an electrician and that's that's what makes them a man, that's going to be very problematic because when a woman's working next to him on his trade he's going to feel like less of a man. So we actually work on that psychological identity work first and really support those men to see their masculinity in different forms, because they're a protector, because they're a provider, because they are achievers and all of these other amazing qualities that men have, and get them to really connect to their masculine identity through those connections, not because he's a plumber, et cetera, et cetera. So that's definitely the first work to do. And then what I really love working with the male leaders is giving them the support and structure of how they can create a psychologically safe environment so then they can foster those conversations to co-create what good looks like for the females that are coming into their team.

Speaker 3:

As we touched on before, like women with endometriosis and things like that might struggle a couple of days a month because of pain and everything like that.

Speaker 3:

So we really work with the male leaders to make sure that they can create cultures where women feel comfortable talking about the needs and supports that they need to have, but also that the men in the team feel comfortable talking about any kind of concerns that they have, whether that's like I don't know whether I help her with her ladder or don't help her with her ladder, like I don't know whether, if there's something heavy, do I step in and help her carry it or don't help her carry it. So so much of the research I've done and interviews with the male demographic shows that there's not necessarily that much malice. There is just a lot of actual fear among men of like I don't know what's the right thing to do, so I'm just going to do nothing and kind of avoid her and exclude her, because I don't want to upset her, but I don't want to do the wrong thing, so I just won't do anything, which is the worst thing to do but that is human nature.

Speaker 2:

It's like a confused mind won't buy. You know a confused mind isn't gonna try either. You know a confused mind isn't going to try either. You know they're just going to. If I do nothing, I don't get in trouble and I don't get praised. But I'm at even ground rather than trying to do one or the other and being right or wrong.

Speaker 3:

So Exactly, and you and I can't speak on behalf of every woman in the world. So that's what I say to the males. I'm like this is you need to have the conversation with the individual women in your team, because what they individually need, they need to have their voices. I can't speak on behalf of all women in the world. I don't know what all women in the world need or want. You need to create cultures where, again, all humans because your main staff might need or want certain things their, their wife might be really unwell and they have now become the primary care of dropping the kids off and picking them up and looking after the household, because their wife is struggling with a terminal illness, for example. That male is going to need some support, he's going to need people in the team to get around him. So you need to create a culture where that male also feels that he can speak up and say, hey, I'm struggling, I need help, yeah, I think this is.

Speaker 2:

it comes back to just like be involved leadership too. You know, if you run a small trades business, get to know the people that are working for you. You know, get to know what's going on in their lives. I understand that they're probably not going to tell you everything, but you're going to notice when they're off. Have a conversation, Ask them something simple like are you doing okay? Is everything okay? You know, do you need support in anything? Sometimes it's just the simple question of do you need support with anything? Can I help you with anything? Because a lot of people have a really hard time asking for help and I can imagine, as a female in the like working specifically in the labor's parts of the trades, lots of times you don't want to ask for things because that's kind of an exclusionary way of you know I'm different or I need something extra, and they feel like they're out there trying to prove themselves against a bunch of these guys. Do you see a lot of that?

Speaker 3:

yeah, I do and it gets to the point of dangerous. So like, um, I know some women that desired some like ppa gear for their knees and things like that and they were really concerned because they're like I don't, no one else has this on site but like I'm very much struggling with my knees and I'm getting like calluses and blisters and I really need some knee pads. I said, well, ask for them. And she's like well, no one else on the team wears the knee pads. I'm like your body is telling you you need the knee pads. Ask for the goddamn knee pads.

Speaker 3:

And you know, she was so, so concerned and scared to ask for the knee pads. So I mentored her. She asked her employer for the knee pads and he's like yeah, sure, he's like, actually it's probably good, I'll ask any of the guys if they want knee pads as well, because I didn't really think about it and the minute of the day, like if they're getting sore knees and different things like that, they're probably not working as good towards the end of the day. So when the question was asked, three or four other guys said yeah, actually, if you're doing an order, put one in for me. I said, see, like the guys just didn't think about it, like it wasn't that they didn't want to support you, they just weren't thinking about it. Once you spoke up, all of a sudden, three or four other people on the team now have what you've asked for. So it wasn't a female-specific thing, it was a human thing that the guys just weren't thinking about asking for.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's smart, even as employers sometimes, like my guys, will be like, hey, we need, and I'm like I didn't even think about that. So, yay, thanks for somebody speaking up.

Speaker 3:

And then it's something that continues to keep showing up all the time exactly as employers and leaders like we can't think of everything we we have to handle and deal with so much. We're not boots on ground day in and day out doing the trades and different things like that, so we're probably not aware of some of the challenges and support that the team needs. And that's where, as leaders, you've really got to drive culture where your team feels safe to really talk about what challenges they're facing, what support they need to overcome those challenges and all of those kind of things like the knee pad situation.

Speaker 2:

Yes, oh, so good, so good. If there's something that you, as being a spokesperson of women in the trades, if there's something that you want women to know that are working in the trades either in the trades as a tradie, or if they are in management or ownership in the trades what is something that you want them to know? Something that's like something you've observed, something that you think that may help them?

Speaker 3:

never doubt your value and never underestimate yourself, like, yes, we're in an industry where you might quite often be dismissed or undermined or felt like you are not being seen for your value.

Speaker 3:

We are an industry that can be quite crushing towards women and my call to action is have that courage to really back yourself. Double down on yourself, believe in your value, believe in what you're bringing to it. Don't listen to those external people like going back to the beginning of the conversation, I didn't listen to the doctors that were telling me I couldn't walk because I knew I could walk. To really go into that internal self-narrative, make Make sure that it is supportive, make sure that it is a positive internal narrative. Make sure that you're celebrating your small wins, even if no one around you is celebrating you. Make sure you celebrate you because, at the end of the day, the women in the industry at the moment are the trailblazers and the game changers and if we never give up, if we have a no excuse mindset, we will forge a path that the next generation and the next generation will just keep coming in and hopefully one day it's just something that humans do is come into the trade-based industry oh, so good.

Speaker 2:

So so good, because you're going to get up to that 30% of women right, 100%, we are. I love it. I love it. Well, tell us what's exciting with the organization and what you guys have coming up.

Speaker 3:

The very exciting news is I found a co-founder for Canada, so I'm the only founder in Australia, and my model to move the movement into other countries is to search for a co-founder that's boots on ground in that country, obviously understands the nuances of legislations, how apprenticeships is done, et cetera, et cetera. So I finally found this amazing woman, lex Lexi, over in Canada, and we'll be launching empowered women in trade in Canada as our first kind of next country after Australia, which is super, super exciting. I can't wait to learn from that country and bring stuff from Australia, bring Australia to Canada and really get this 30 by 30, so 30% female representation by 2030. Not just something that Australia is pushing towards, but now Canada and hopefully one day the US and hopefully the UK as well, so that we have all of those amazing countries pushing to get 30% female representation in skilled trades by 2030.

Speaker 2:

That is so cool. Well, I will be cheering you on as one of those women, definitely through this podcast, and we'd love to continue to support wherever you guys end up expanding to. This is so, so cool. This has been such an incredible conversation. I've had so much fun having conversations with you. If someone wants to connect with you and they want to learn more about the organization, they want to learn more about your story, how to connect or possibly work with you, where would they go to find you?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, so for me personally, my website is just HACIA, which is H-A-C-I-A Atherton, a-t-h-e-r-t-o-ncom, and then for Empowered Women and Trades it's E-W-I, then trades with an Scom. So that's our website. And then all of our social media handles of LinkedIn and Instagram are the same. So if you put HACIA Atheron in LinkedIn, you'll come across me. If you put EWI Trades in LinkedIn and Instagram, you'll come across the business page as well.

Speaker 2:

That is incredible, and we'll be sure to link everything in the show notes too and promote whatever you guys end up putting out, because you ladies put out, because it's so incredibly important that we continue this conversation. What I would love to know is if someone let's just say in states wants to get involved, say even at a local level, and they want to be able to produce something amazing like what you have created, but maybe just even smaller, at a local level. Talking to the schools, talking to women in the trades, how would you encourage them to get started?

Speaker 3:

you very much need a community. So if you want to get that movement of that grassroots over in the US, I would suggest first of all speaking to some of your local schools and say this is the trade that I do. Can I come in for, like you know, one of the class sessions and teach the students how to do my trade? Then, if you want to do it on a slightly larger scale is work out a couple of other local employers and local tradies in the community and say, hey, could we actually run a whole day with a school together, like the three different trades come in, we do some fun activities, the kids can rotate through it and different things like that. So that's a really, really great way to do it.

Speaker 3:

And the same setting up networking groups like for a lot of women it is very lonely out there working, often the only female in their, in their job or on their site. So setting up like tradie lady breakfast and things like that, where you can come and get like an egg and bacon roll and a coffee or whatever is the breakfast of choice and you can all just get together before you head to site for a half an hour or an hour and just have a chat with each other. I think it's really important we set that community up for women. So I would highly advise yeah, set up a local networking group and then connect with some of the schools and see if you can just go in there and show some of the students your trade and try and get a couple of other local employers to come in with you as well.

Speaker 2:

I love that. Thank you for sharing that, because I think a lot of times women in the sender show are like I never get invited to anything, I don't know where to go, like they're waiting for someone to bring them along. Sometimes you got to build that damn table yourself and sometimes you got to not be scared. That's one of my favorite things.

Speaker 3:

I'm'm like I'm not waiting for a seat at the table, I'm building my goddamn table yes, yes, and then I'll bring people over and bring a friend. You know like it's so people to sit at my table?

Speaker 2:

yeah, and then I don't never have to be invited to anything again, because you exactly so you're being courageous, be proactive, like for all the women out there.

Speaker 3:

If you want to do something, go do it. Don't don't wait for someone to open the door for you. If you're really passionate about getting the next generation in, reach out to the school and the whoever runs careers and and um stuff at the school. And if you're a mom with a child at a school, just reach out to your school where you send your child and say, hey, I'd love to come and do a session for the students at the school, the female students at the school, to show them what I do every day.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, there's always plenty of teachers. I know my daughter's a sophomore in high school and she's in a business class. I'm like I don't care what you take, but you have to take business classes. But she is in a business class this year and they're teaching entrepreneurship and they're always teachers like that are always looking for real life examples, to come in and talk to the schools and let them know what the opportunities are, because there's so many different jobs out there now. Let them know what the opportunities are because there's so many different jobs out there now. So if you've got one, you know that you're proud of being in. Definitely reach out to those schools are always looking for help and in showing people what is possible.

Speaker 2:

This has been such an incredible conversation and I love so much being able to network with incredible women from literally all over the world that are involved in these industries. That's the whole reason why Ladies Kickin' Ass was built was because I said that I'm going to build my own goddamn table and bring some women together that we can have awesome conversations about this industry. But what I love about the title of this podcast is that whenever I say I have a podcast and it's called Ladies Kickin' Ass people go tell me more. It's not necessarily that it's just the trades, it's women that have an incredible story to share, and I think that many people are inspired by the way people get into things, the way people overcome things, just like you have done what you've been able to just grow and prosper and now take to another country that you probably never thought hey, like this is even possible, like it's so incredible to see that. So when you hear the phrase ladies kicking ass, what does that mean to you in your life?

Speaker 3:

What does that mean to you in your life? Yeah, so for me, I really see that as what we're talking about that internal kind of strength and women really starting to see their worth, see their value, find their voice, find their strength and going out there and starting to set boundaries and be like no, we're not going to accept this, like no, we're not going to accept this behavior. We're not going to accept this door being closed. We're not going to accept this is not an opportunity that's actively being provided to us, because we know we can, we know we're worth it, we know we can excel in this and we're going to do whatever it takes, with no excuses, to make sure that we go after what we want to go after. And that's because they have that internal I'm going to kick ass internally and they have that courage, they see their worth, they see their value.

Speaker 2:

Yes, it's so important, and especially in what we're talking about today. So thank you so much for sharing.

Speaker 3:

Like another one of my favorite sayings is like no one's going to save you, we have to be our own heroes. We have to be our own heroes.

Speaker 2:

Yes and ladies, you've got it in you to do whatever the hell you want to. You know, tighten your own cape and make your own dreams come true, because you can, and it's really cool that you've got incredible support like these two organizations behind you that want to see you succeed. So please reach out if you need anything and until then, keep kicking ass.

Speaker 1:

Thanks for being part of the ladies kick and ask community Cheers to all you badass women out there. Keep rocking your power, igniting your and making waves in the service industry. If you loved today's episode, please do me a quick favor. Take a screenshot, post it and tag us at LadiesKickinAss. Be sure to include the link to your favorite episode. Your support in spreading the word means the world to us as we aim to empower even more women. Hit that subscribe button to stay tuned for more kick-ass episodes. And don't forget a five-star review is the ultimate high five. Connect with us on social media. All the links are in the show notes. Thank you for being part of our tribe. Now go kick some serious ass, lady.

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Tanya Wilson

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